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When Kevin Cannella was a student with hardly a dollar to his name, he sat with ayahuasca over 70 times. Money wasn’t a limiting factor, and he recognized that. So now, he’s paying it forward as the founder of a non-profit that eliminates financial barriers to psychedelic therapy.

We spoke to Kevin about the differences between psycholytic vs psychedelic therapy, why all ketamine clinics aren’t created equal, and how people in financial need can access psychedelics today.

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How have your personal experiences with psychedelics influenced your work as a therapist and the mission of Thank You Life?

I've had a range of experiences, from powerful mystical encounters in undergrad to about 70-75 ayahuasca ceremonies over a few years. Later, while in grad school at Naropa, I took a break to focus on integrating psychotherapy into my practice. After that, I explored clinical use, including ketamine therapy with my supervisor and MDMA-assisted therapy sessions.

My journey has given me a unique perspective as a therapist. One of my strengths is being able to hold space for clients' transpersonal experiences, regardless of their spiritual or cultural background. I’m well versed in many religions and spiritual experiences, so I'm comfortable whether someone sees Mother Mary during ketamine therapy or talks about exorcising demons during an ayahuasca ceremony. I can help clients unpack and interpret these experiences without pathologizing them, similar to how a Jungian therapist might work with dreams.

My personal experiences also help me support clients through intense physical and emotional processes during psychedelic therapy. I've been through it myself, so I understand the importance of allowing clients to express themselves fully, whether that means writhing, screaming, or recreating childhood experiences.

As for Thank You Life, it's partly inspired by seeing my own transformation and wanting to help others experience similar growth. I've been fortunate in my mental health, so I'm driven to help those who are struggling more. It's also influenced by my years of receiving these transformative experiences through volunteering and work-trade when I couldn't afford them. Now that I'm in a position to give back, I want to provide others with the same opportunities that shaped me.

You're trained in both ketamine-assisted therapy and MDMA-assisted therapy. What are the most important differences between these two modalities?

Stan Grof describes "psycholytic" versus "psychedelic" experiences. Psycholytic is more like a museum dose. You feel something but can still function. MDMA often falls into this category, not necessarily due to dosing, but because of its qualities. The default mode network stays online, unlike with psilocybin or LSD.

MDMA therapy is very relational. Clients can have intense internal experiences, then come back and have a coherent conversation with the therapist. It's great for working with attachment wounds and processing trauma through the nervous system.

Ketamine can be both psycholytic and psychedelic, depending on the route of administration. Lozenges tend to produce more relational, psycholytic experiences. Intramuscular (IM) ketamine is more like a rocket ship—a full-on psychedelic experience.

With IM ketamine, after administering the shot, the client is usually very still and internal for about 45 minutes. They might have out-of-body or transpersonal experiences, like feeling at one with everything or encountering a sense of divinity. These can be just as impactful as processing specific memories or traumas, but in a different way.

The relational aspect of high-dose ketamine work often comes during integration. As clients come back into their bodies, there's usually an hour or so where they're not fully sober but can engage in deep therapeutic work. Parts work often emerges naturally in this state, allowing clients to interact with different aspects of themselves in profound ways.

How does Thank You Life determine who receives funding for psychedelic therapy? What is the typical process for applicants?

Currently, we have three distinct processes to provide funding for psychedelic therapy.

The first process begins when a client is unable to afford treatment at one of our partner clinics. The clinic handles the initial financial conversation with the client to determine what they can afford and how much support they need. We trust the clients and try to make treatment affordable, though not necessarily free. The clinic then reaches out to us with the funding request, and we either approve it or place the client on a waitlist, depending on our available resources. We're cautious about building a large waitlist, so we're expanding slowly.

We also fund KAP group cohorts at certain clinics, which reduces costs and adds a valuable community aspect to the treatment. We've focused on three priority populations: veterans, the LGBTQ+ community, and BIPOC folks. We're starting to expand to other communities, like the deaf and hard of hearing and the autistic community. For these group programs, we often secure specific funding for discrete projects, like a $20,000 program for eight participants.

The third model allows for restricted funding to particular clinics. This approach addresses the desire for local impact and the connection clients might have with specific clinicians. It's like a "pay it forward" model for people who want to support others in their community or through a clinician they trust.

We're still figuring out how to balance these different approaches, but our goal is to be a platform that can support various communities in accessing psychedelic therapy, while making the most of our available resources.

What about the provider side? How does Thank You Life select psychedelic therapists and clinics to work with, and what do those collaborations look like?

As a 501(c)(3), Thank You Life works exclusively with legal ketamine clinics in the U.S. Our vetting process is a key aspect of our work, ensuring we partner with top-notch clinics. This likely contributes to the incredible outcome data we're seeing.

The main distinction in our vetting process is whether a clinic offers ketamine-assisted psychotherapy (KAP) rather than just ketamine infusions without significant psychological support. We believe KAP leads to more lasting results by addressing underlying psychological issues, not just temporarily soothing the nervous system.

We also assess potential partners based on their training and experience, their licensing and credentials, and their motivations and approach to the work.

While KAP is a non-negotiable for us, we allow for both psycholytic (low-medium dose, more relational) and psychedelic (higher dose, more internal) approaches to ketamine therapy. The key is the integration work that happens after the ketamine session, whether it's processing a parts work session or unpacking a mystical experience.

This integration piece is crucial and typically isn't part of the process at infusion-only clinics. Our hypothesis is that while ketamine alone can be incredibly beneficial, especially in crisis situations like suicidal ideation, combining it with psychotherapy will lead to more lasting healing and transformation.

So far, Thank You Life has focused solely on ketamine-assisted therapy. With the approval of MDMA hanging in the balance, what does the future hold for Thank You Life?

While we're currently focused on ketamine-assisted therapy, we're definitely looking to work with MDMA if it gets approved. Many of our partner clinics are likely to be early adopters of MDMA therapy, which positions us well.

However, we don't think ketamine is going anywhere soon. First, there’s the cost to consider. One of our partner clinics has estimated that MDMA-assisted therapy will cost them $25,000 per client and that they will likely need to charge at least $30,000 to make the business work. That’s significantly more than ketamine therapy. Then, you have the time commitment. Ketamine sessions are typically 2-3 hours and can be done mid-week, with clients able to return to work the next day. MDMA sessions are much longer (around 8 hours) and require at least a full day of recovery. Finally, ketamine has already shown its value in treating anxiety and depression.

We're excited about the potential of MDMA therapy, and it might open doors to new funders who are more familiar with or interested in traditional psychedelics. However, the higher cost per client presents its own challenges.

Regardless of how quickly MDMA and other psychedelics like psilocybin become available, we see a long-term role for ketamine therapy. There's still so much work to be done, and ketamine is a brilliant molecule that's already helping many people.

Want more from Kevin?

If you’re a clinician, apply to join Thank You Life’s provider network. If you’ve been helped by psychedelic therapy, consider becoming a monthly donor to pay it forward.

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DISCLAIMER: This newsletter is for educational and informational purposes only and is not intended as a substitute for professional medical advice. The use, possession, and distribution of psychedelic drugs are illegal in most countries and may result in criminal prosecution.